The EthnoMed Podcast

Provider Pulse Ep. 17: Kenn Arning - 47 years as Harborview's Postal Detective and Community Builder

• Dr. Duncan Reid, MD @ EthnoMed.org • Season 1 • Episode 17

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This episode of Provider Pulse goes beyond clinical roles and takes you behind the scenes with Kenn Arning, Harborview’s longtime mail clerk and self-described ‘postal detective.’ For more than four decades, Kenn has sorted 5,000 pieces of mail a day, tracked down misdirected packages, and built connections across every department in the hospital.

Kenn shares how his Quaker education, global travels, and passion for learning about people and the places they are from shaped his work — and why Harborview’s mission keeps him coming back year after year. This is a conversation about service, curiosity, and the unseen networks that hold a hospital community together.

Resources mentioned in the episode:

Working: People Talk About What They Do All Day and How They Feel About What They Do by Studs Terkel

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/59649.Working


FIUTS: Foundation for International Understanding Through Students.

https://www.fiuts.org/



Visit EthnoMed.org for additional resources. Follow us on YouTube and Instagram @EthnoMedUW

250506 Kenn Arning 

[00:00:00] 

Kenn: I'm always go to unite people and to make people feel welcome. So a certain kind of person like me and most Harborview employees wanna help those who really need help. And the more they need help, the more I want to be engaged. I love being postal detective and my connections. I'm solving mysteries in my own way and using my skills.

Duncan: Welcome to the EthnoMed podcast. I'm Dr. Duncan Reid, a provider at harborview's International Medicine Clinic and Medical Director of EthnoMed. On today's episode for the Provider Pulse series our conversation is a little different. Instead of speaking with a healthcare professional, we are sitting down with someone who knows every department of Harborview Medical Center and has a unique understanding and interest in the cultural diversity of the Harborview staff.

Meet Kenn Arning Harborview's, longtime mail clerk and self-described mail detective.

For over four decades, Kenn has been sorting, delivering, and tracking down misdirected mail [00:01:00] while developing deep connections across the hospital community. In this episode, Ken reflects on what inspires him to keep working at Harborview and the importance of travel and cross-cultural connection in his own life and work.

If you're a pre-health student, medical professional, or a community member, interested in the hidden stories of hospital life. Kenn's story is a reminder that medical institutions rely on the expertise, passion, and sense of mission of thousands of individuals who are not directly involved in patient care.

Kenn: Testing 6, 7, 8. Yeah, it's good.

Zambia. Botswana, Angola, Mozambique.

My name is Kenn Arning. I work in the Harborview Mail room for many years and I visit people in International Medicine Clinic periodically.

Duncan: And you, probably one of the longest working people at Harborview now. How long has it been?

Kenn: I came to Harborview the summer of 1980, and at this point there's two people been here longer. There's two [00:02:00] people been here 50 years. They're in the psych ward and they don't have high visibility. I connect with pretty much every department in the Harborview.

Duncan: Wow.

what does a day look like for you in the mail capacity?

Kenn: Let's see, uh, the first thing after I come to work, I go to admitting, get the census, the alphabetical list of all the inpatients that I'll need because the patients get, get well cards and gifts every day. And the first three hours a day, I'm sorting US mail. Then after lunch I am sending mail out from various clinics, from various departments, and the rest of the time I'm problem solving, dealing with poorly addressed mail, connecting with people and all departments.

Duncan: Would it be okay to just talk about your, past Yeah. Um, where are you from originally?

Kenn: I grew up in South Jersey, the suburbs of Philadelphia. I went to a Quaker high school, got a great education. Then I went to Rutgers University. I have a degree in [00:03:00] political geography with a minor in German. I really know 19th century German literature. After that, I was in Europe for six months, mostly Northern Europe.

Then I moved to North Carolina. I was a military council for three years at Quaker House. I helped people get out of the army as conscientious objectors. I still have one friend from then from 50 years ago, One of my first CO cases. Then I moved to Philadelphia itself and lived in a communal houses, part of an organization called Movement for New Society, a nonviolent social change group that I'm still connected with.

Then it was time for a change in my life and I moved to Seattle with my girlfriend, and a year later I started University of Washington Mail room.

Duncan: How did you get into political geography

Kenn: National Graphic Magazine was a big influence in me as a young man, as a teenager. I was fascinated by other cultures and things that are different from me and the rest of my life. What I enjoy most [00:04:00] is more different from my lived experience. I've been to 75 countries. Africa interests me the most, so the more different it is, the more interesting.

 So I've really never been to England 'cause it's too similar. I, I like different, that's my style.

Duncan: And you went to Quaker school?

Kenn: Yes. At Quaker high school,

Duncan: Are you from a Quaker background?

Kenn: no, that was the only private school in South Jersey, so that's where I went. But it had a huge influence on me and I've stayed with it.

Duncan: what influence from the Quaker school you think,

Kenn: The values of honesty and integrity. Walk your walk do what you believe in. and then always non-violence. Since I was a teenager, non-violent social change has been important to me to not just accept things as they are, but try to change and make things better for those who are less fortunate than myself.

People that didn't have the advantages that I had, it's always important to me to reach out to them and try to meet them on equal ground. Those [00:05:00] who have less than me. 

Duncan: did those values align with the ones that you grew up with in your family?

Kenn: no, no, no. Particularly strong values in my family, no, not really. I didn't have strong values. Both my grandfathers from Germany, one grandmother's from Scotland, one's from Netherlands. 

Duncan: Yes. I can't honestly say it came from my family or my parents. They were good parents, but, I didn't get much grounding, but I, did through the Quaker High School. And one person in particular, Hadie Forsyth, who turned a hundred this week. She died long ago, but she would be a hundred. The mother of one of my classmates was one of the greatest people I ever met, and she taught me the value of, making time to talk to people, not coming across rushed.

Kenn: I don't have time. I'm too busy. But stopping what you're doing and listening and showing kind of an open heart to people, I learned that value when I was 20 to share who I am and don't hide myself with people.

Duncan: Well, that makes a lot of sense. And it served you well in your job [00:06:00] here. Can you tell me about Northern Europe? What were you doing there

Kenn: Yes. Uh, connection I made through that same Hattie Forsyth There was a German priest who I met, and he got me a job in a German boarding school, so was an English tutor, dorm counselor, Also, I spent a month in Norway traveling in Austria, France, and other countries, in line with interest in geography, other cultures, other languages.

I could say I'm obsessed with maps my whole life. I'm Mr. Map. I have several maps up in my office at work, over my bed a World Map, at home, in my car, everywhere I am, there's maps. I, I brought a map with me today, I'm a map centric person more than anyone I know.

Duncan: When you went to Northern Europe? Was that your first time abroad?

Kenn: correct. I had not traveled at all growing up.

Duncan: And how was that?

Kenn: Uh, it was great. I had a good experience. That's where I started relating to people more different than myself. Growing up until I went to college, most people looked like [00:07:00] me. There were not many people who looked different from me growing up.

 And then I was exposed to other cultures and I loved it. I've blossomed then the rest of my life, I gravitate towards people that are different from me or different backgrounds. I still have some Norway connections. Harborview got a letter from Norway, a few days ago and it turned out it was a nurse that retired 20 years ago from Harborview, but she got a personal letter from Norway and it was very hard to track her down.

But I did, and I talked on the phone for a half hour. She lives in Ballard. She's older than me and I got her address. I'll be forwarding that letter from Norway. But I love being postal detective and my connections.  I like making connections to the people.

Duncan: And then just going back, so you went to Rutgers and then you went to Northern Europe. So you already set the stage thinking about political geography that you were gonna travel.

Kenn: Yes, I did. So for 30 years I went to a new country every year, a new place.

I often had to stop a couple other [00:08:00] countries to get there. Like when I went to Mongolia, I stopped in Beijing also. So that's where I get to 75 countries. And always a new place for 30 years. It was always somewhere new and all over the world. I have certain favorite areas, 

Would you be willing to. About Fort Bragg at all your experience there?

sure. When I was there, there was a hundred thousand active duty army soldiers at Fort Bragg. It was the end of the war in Vietnam, and it was considered the most militarized town in the United States at that point. The home of the Green Berets also, and a number of US soldiers brought back wives from Vietnam.

There was a large population of Vietnamese soldier wives. I had a good experience there. I'm good with people. So being a counselor to people enlisted in the army, but they saw the light and they didn't want to take part in war and killing anymore. So I helped them get out as conscientious objectors.

It was a long, several month process, each individual, but a hundred percent success rate. They all got outta the [00:09:00] army. So I'm always anti-war, anti-guns, anti-violence, but you have to do it with respect to the other person. You can't push your values on another person.

Duncan: I didn't know that there was a counselor role for conscientious objectors. How did people come to your attention? Or were you just assigned to them?

Kenn: No, they came to me. We tried to be well known in the community, publicized, various ways. So it wasn't an easy process once you're in the Army to get out as being a conscientious objector, not easy. So variety of ways they found us. And then we had a house and a center people came to, and giving them moral support.

And it's a very, very cumbersome process for the military to get out. It happens, but it's certainly not easy and you have to have very strong convictions. And they did. And I supported people through the process.

Duncan: Were there any commonalities that came up of their experience? or did everyone have kind of unique reasons for why they, decided not to be in the military anymore?

Kenn: Part [00:10:00] of the answer is recruiters. So the recruiter's job is to get a quota, let's say a hundred men. In those days, it was 99% men, so they got them, but the people that signed in didn't know what they were signing up for. They were often just out of high school, had less advantages , less education.

So they thought it was gonna be great. And then when they saw the reality of it after basic training, and they learned that they were gonna use a rifle to shoot the quote unquote enemy, that gave them pause to think. And then they decided that's not for them. They didn't know what they signed up for, and then they found out, fortunately, there's always been conscientious objectors in the military since World War ii.

And still today, for those who have a change of heart.

Duncan: And you spent three years doing that.

Kenn: I did, yes,

Duncan: And then you went on, to a daycare. You were working at a

Kenn: working at a daycare center primarily with 4-year-old kids in West Philadelphia. I've always liked working with children, but I was part of a social change community. There were 10 communal houses. Part of the [00:11:00] movement for new society That's when.

Sisterhood is powerful came out the beginnings of feminism. So I've always been a strong supporter of women. Feminism and other social change movements were happening the same time. The Black Power Movement, black Rights, women's Rights, gay rights, they all kind of happened at that time period, mid early seventies.

And I was into that and I've stayed with those values.

Duncan: And then after that you said you were on and off as a vet tech.

Kenn: Yes. Uh, originally in high school I wanted to be a veterinarian 'cause I love animals. I worked for a veterinarian's office several times in my life, but, that's not what I studied in college ultimately. But I still love animals and particularly less common or well-known animals. My specialty is not the common animals often from Africa.

And I know lots and lots of animals that 90% of people never heard of.

Duncan: What are your top few?

Kenn: Well, the cuttlefish and octopus is my favorite. I know people do know octopus, but the intelligence of the cuttlefish is [00:12:00] not well known. I'll mention the Pangolin is the most trafficked animal in the world, you know, abused, 

I've always been an underwater person as snorkeling, scuba diving, all my adult life. So I know a lot of fish species 

I was 30 ready for a change in my life. To me Pittsburgh was the beginning of the West Coast where I grew up. I never really went west. I came here in a Greyhound bus with my girlfriend, knowing one person in Washington. I stayed with him briefly. Then I settled down then the next week, I'm an apartment manager since 1977, I've stayed at an old 10 unit apartment building across the Volunteer park. I was looking for a job. I worked for vet tech, but then there was an opening University of Washington mail room. I got it. And I've stayed ever since.

Duncan: Did you know anything about the University of Washington or Harborview before you signed up for that job?

Kenn: Not really. Just Harborview was the trauma center and for low income people was a good place to go.

Duncan: And then can you just take us through what was it like? So you were at Harborview,

Kenn: Right. Uh, how

Duncan: were you at? University of [00:13:00] Washington

Kenn: So, I was University of Washington for a year. The hub at UW had a post office, a traditional post office held stamps, and I did that for a year. Then there was a dispute, the US Post Office, and I came to Harborview.

There was an opening and I agreed to work here for two years now, 48 years later on, I'm still here 'cause I love my job. Did I know much about Harborview? No. And it was much smaller then. It was really just the main building and Harborview Hall, a seven story building was active with labs and various departments were there.

so Harborview has grown and grown and grown.

Duncan: So your first mail job at University of Washington and at the hub was kind of like a more standard postal office

Kenn: Right. I sorted mail at uw and then for a year I sold stamps, a thousand dollars a day worth of stamps. Oh, I'm also a stamp collector also. Ever since then, yes. I have a lot of, a lot of stamps at home. And for years in the Harborview Mail room, I sold stamps on the side. I would buy a few hundred dollars worth [00:14:00] and sell them to employees for no profit.

So my primary duty, of course, is sort the mail that comes in. A lot of business mail comes in. People might be surprised that medical records has always been my primary customer. 

 I do get, about 20 get well cards for patients every day of the year. It's not based in seasons. People think it's more at Christmas or holidays. No, there's always get well cards.

Every day I get gifts for patients, either short term or long term patients. And I guess my favorite thing about the job is delivering to the patients. I go directly to the patient, to their floor at the end of the day and deliver the mail or the get well card.

And, um, due to my personality, I often relate to them, talk to them, get to know something about their life story, and never, of course ask their medical, any medical issues. But I make friends with them and want them to feel welcome at Harborview. I've become better and better and better at welcoming people, greeting people, making 'em feel at home is one of my skills.[00:15:00] 

Duncan: You were saying at the beginning too, that you sort mail that comes into Harborview and it's hours of sorting, and I'm naive to this. Is it all the mail that goes into one central place or does it get parsed out to the different buildings?

Kenn: Uh, it all comes to one place, right to me. So a driver from UW pick up from the US Post Office. Then I sort it out, and there are satellite mail rooms 

So the other buildings have a, room with mail in it.uh, then campus mail, then mail from UW also comes twice a day. Interdepartmental campus mail is, of course, important,

Duncan: So you're just sorting everything in your main office over there. Right. And how many pieces is that?

Kenn: I'm going to say 5,000 pieces of mail a day. and then because I've done a long time, I can tell often three feet away where it's gonna go. I can tell by the return address or the shape of a box. I'm good at knowing, identifying where it's gonna go. One second. 'cause of repetition.[00:16:00] 

Duncan: Wow. What changes have, occurred since the 1980s? 

Kenn: the past 20 years, everything is sorted by barcode, became more and more important.

And these days, all mail that you and I and the patients get, there's a barcode on the front and back of every envelope, and it's scanned with the post office by the barcode. the. importance of zip codes in the correct address. Five times a day I am correcting, addressing mistakes.

Staff don't know the proper format for the post office, how to address mail. The most common one is mail by the post was read bottom up, Seattle, Washington, 9 8 1 0 4. Then the street address, then the Harborview box number. Then the name and the department isn't relevant because of the box number. It tells us the department.

So people often don't have an right sequence and that delays the mail for everyone and they don't know what's delaying their mail

What about the handwriting? Is that a big issue that comes up?

Uh, no, it's okay. I've, of course, of years of experience I have to be able to read, handwriting, hand addressing, but people, [00:17:00] almost no staff, realize it makes a difference in price going out. So when clinics mail to a patient, if it's machine generated mail, it's 6 cents cheaper than hand address mail. So the post office gives a discount because it's easier for their sorting machines if it's machine generated.

So if someone hand addresses to a patient, it costs 6 cents more than if they didn't. But that's the price we pay,

Duncan: What about your interactions with patients? Well, patients and staff. How has that changed over from the 1980s when you started?

Kenn: Uh, I always liked that I'm a people person. I like on staff. I'll say with patients though, HIPAA regulations have phased in since I've been here. It wasn't such a big issue in 1980 about privacy and HIPAA regulations. Now, of course it is, and that only increases, I've learned to be diplomatic, what not to say.

A whole nother thing is misaddressed, things that are addressed wrong. So I've gotten probably a thousand boxes for Amazon [00:18:00] employees ' cause they built a building in South Lake Union whose address is 3 25 Avenue North and they don't put the north address.

Then I get it from UPS or the post office, but it really is supposed to go to Amazon employee. That's literally over a thousand boxes. It came like that. Unfortunate. Also, Seattle University nearby.

So dealing with other people's mistakes is I don't know, 20% of my job I'm always a postal educator and they're, the people are innocent.

They don't know they're addressing it wrong or there handwriting's clear, various its reasons, but I take it upon myself to try to educate 'em so they don't do it again and again.

Duncan: And then can you talk about, the community that you felt here? I think of all the people, you know, more of the workers than anyone.

Than anyone. Yeah.

Kenn: Yes, but that's my personality. It's So I've always said if there was a tragedy or disaster and there were many, many dead bodies, I'd know more than anybody who they are. And now we all, of course, wore name tags. In the old days we didn't all wear name [00:19:00] tags. But yes, I know ' cause I deal with orthopedics, ophthalmology, international medicine, every department all the time.

And I'm a friendly, social, outgoing person. So I get to know the backstory. I know where the employee's from, I've sensitive where they find out people if they're from Netherlands or from Zimbabwe or if they're from Cameroon, whether they're French or the British side of Cameroon, things like that.

'Cause they interest me. That's melding my interest in geography and employees and I'm always go to unite people and to make people feel welcome. I never want to be divisive or make feel like the other, or a stigma or like they don't belong. I'm always finding ways to have people feel like they belong, everyone doesn't look like me.

Duncan: you must have seen different, demographic changes in the employee base since you started too. Are there any general themes that you've seen?

Kenn: Yes. The whole time I've been here, this a high percentage of people from the Philippines. But in the [00:20:00] past 20 years, there's a high percentage from the Horn of Africa. Seattle has a hundred thousand people from Somalia and Ethiopia and Eritrea, a few people from other parts of Africa. And Africa is my main interest area.

So some countries you'll see Gambia, Nigeria and Ghana, but you never see people from Ivory Coast or Algeria or Namibia. So it varies. And that fascinates me. It's not part of my job and I'm always trying to do that sensitively. 

And then during this time, did your travel really start taking off after you moved to Seattle?

Yes, it did. So every year a new country, I've been all over. I like exploring other cultures.I've been to the Philippines. so I know basic words in Tagalog,

Duncan: One of the things that I noticed is that you really like small islands. Yes. Are there some small islands that you can educate us about that we wouldn't have known about otherwise?

Kenn: Yes, that's my specialty. That's melding my interest in snorkeling, swimming, being in the water and [00:21:00] islands and geography. Socotra, not many people know that it's off the coast of Somalia. The British gave it to Yemen, so it's technically part of Yemen. Socotra has their own language. Arabic is their second language.

It's a fairly large island. It's in a strategic place in Arabia Sea, near the Red Sea. But the people of farmers and fishermen, no wars going on there. And when I was there, they said four Americans per year go to Socotra. 

I went to the Banda islands, which is very hard to get to, the island was center of the nutmeg spice trade 400 years ago. It was traded from Manhattan, New York, and Banda Banda was more important than Manhattan, New York then now I think that's changed. It was very, very hard to get the Banda.

There's no scheduled way to get there. Andaman Islands is not well known. It's technically part of India. It's off the coast of Burma. It was where the British in the old days sent freedom fighters from India.

So there's a famous big jail there, kind of the Alcatraz of [00:22:00] India. So Madagascar, I've spent four birthdays at Madagascar. There's only one Malagasy employee at Harborview that I'm aware of. I'm friends with her. 

I've been to all the islands around Africa. Zanzibar and, Mauritius Reunion, then the Cape Verde Islands, Canary and Azores. 

Duncan: Are there interesting stories from your work that stand out to you or, I think a lot of mislabeled mail.

Kenn: Yes, I get that all the time. so my process when mislabelled mail first, I think, is it for a patient? Is it for employee? is the patient discharged? Are they here, is the employee in the UW staff directory? If not, then I go to Google. Sometimes it works, sometimes they have to go deeper in the internet to find the person.

And like the one this week, she retired 20 years ago and wasn't easy to find in the internet. And I like that. I'm good at that, that I really enjoy that. and then mail comes for people that are no longer here in various departments. 

Any other curious [00:23:00] anecdotes that you have?

Yes. Uh, patients that are discharged, but they still get mail, that happens all the time. Sometimes those patients will call me, contact me saying, I discharged five days ago, but I'm expecting gift from my aunt or get well cards.

And sometimes there's money or valuable things they're getting, so of course, the patient wants to figure out how to get the item to them. I'm always dealing with that. at least once a week, I get letters from patients that have mental health problems and write rambling letters that don't have a lot of sense to them, and there's nothing directly they're asking for.

So I treat that with respect and dignity and try to find a way to solve that issue or try to help the patient that has mental health problems, but is reaching out to Harborview in a way that's not easy. Through writing a letter to help them. But I always, of course have to, I want to respect the patient and respect the differences in who they are.

Sometimes letters in other alphabets, other countries, and they don't realize that, it's hard. [00:24:00] So I can find people that speak Czech or Polish or Mongolian and I know what employees I know who to go to. Yes,

Duncan: Why did you stay in this job so long?

Kenn: I love it. It's a short answer, uh, clearly in all this. I like relating to people. the majority of employees think when they retire, they're gonna travel.

They put off travel or see the world till they're older. Then often that doesn't happen. The physical difficulties, a variety of reasons. They, they don't travel. So I traveled all through my thirties, forties, fifties, sixties. I've did what other people think they're gonna do in retirement that don't do. so I like that.

what keeps me here, the challenge, both mental and physical challenge. So I walk a lot the second half of the day delivering things to the various parts of the hospital, and I try to keep my finger on the pulse of any department. What's changing? 

There used to be called the refugee clinic, it's not called that anymore. So names changed. so it keeps me on my toes [00:25:00] mentally and physically, then dealing with people. 

So how to have nuances of finding out, again to include people, not to exclude them.

Duncan: What do you think keeps people working at Harborview?

Kenn: The mission, it's true for me and most people here that we serve the underserved population, people from other countries, English wasn't the first language. People that are incarcerated, people that had a traumatic, medical injury, you know, and accidents, the trauma patients. We're helping those that need help the most either because of language, medical condition, where they're from, their income.

We help those people. So a certain kind of person like me and most Harborview employees wanna help those who really need help. And the more they need help, the more I want to be engaged. And same with yourself. And most Harborview employees wanna help those that really need help. And so it, it's to be a better person.

Duncan: You know, we were talking studs Terkel in that book, [00:26:00] working. Who do you think we should talk to in Harborview to understand how this hospital works and that mission? ' cause it seems like it's a certain threshold of people that allow a mission like that to work. I don't know. You probably know better than anyone else.

Kenn: Yes, I know the Harborview employee population, well, my first thought is housekeeping. They're mostly all from other countries. They're very hardworking. They really more desperate for job, I'm gonna say, than a college graduate from United States. So they wanna work hard, they wanna prove themselves, they wanna provide for their family.

But often they don't have the confidence that I have in expressing their views, but to get through to people and housekeeping. Then any department, the front desk office staff in international medicine, orthopedic clinic, eye clinic, the person who answers the phone and greets the patient, 

So the people in the front line, they deal with things differently. The people in the back office don't have to deal with, they deal with it. [00:27:00] And sometimes they get abuse or mistreatment, racism happens occasionally with that. So the people on their front lines of any clinic.

And the doctors there's good diversity in the Harborview physicians here also. why physicians wanna work here. I'm always under the impression the doctors could make more money, perhaps in private practice. And why do physicians stay at Harborview for a long time?

And the rewards they get, so it's not for the money. Like it is for a lot of people in our society, it's about money less so at Harborview That's great. And that's a commonality of the staff. They're not in it, so to speak, for the money of the status so much, but more serving people. That's me. That's you and that's most Harborview employees.

Duncan: I learned a lot just about your history too, and I think I'm appreciating the mail job of it. Sounds quite interesting now, the way you framed it, ' cause you get part kind of like very quantitative sorting, but then you have to deal with a lot of human messiness on the other side.

Kenn: [00:28:00] Absolutely.

Duncan: richness and it does.

And the detective stuff sounds quite interesting as well.

Kenn: Fascinating for me. I love it, is some postal detective. I get compliments every day on my skill in finding something that's not so obvious. If it's addressed correctly and it's just going to medical records or the ortho clinic, that's kind of easy, but that's not the majority of what I do. And solving puzzle, solving mysteries, just like a patient comes in with a disease, it's not obvious what it is.

I'm solving mysteries in my own way and using my skills. Yeah, sorting mail is fun for me. So I'm an organized person and the mail room and sorting the mail has to be neat and organized and presentable. Roughly a hundred people a day come in the mail room staff to pick up the mail. So in my opinion, it should be neat and organized.

 That fits my personality, right?

Duncan: you can help me.

Kenn: Yes,

Duncan: Yes. Um, yes.

Kenn: There's a picture on the wall of the [00:29:00] office where I am that some physicians are not as organized as others. That has nothing to do with their profession, but some people are neat and organized, and that certainly helps

Duncan: Well, what questions do you have for me?

Kenn: for you. I'm not sure as an interviewer, as a person or as a physician.

Duncan: Any?

Kenn: Oh, okay. The main thing, why do you stay at Harborview? You've been here several years, I know something about your background, so why do you stay here versus going to another, hospital where get bigger payer, go into private practice? Why do you stay

Duncan: No. I think it's because of mission and I think the richness of interaction. The same way that you get excited by seeing people from different countries. I always wanted to work in global health. I think with family it makes it very hard to be abroad. So what better way to do global health at home than take care of an international community and always an opportunity to learn things and then feel like there are people that, need whatever help you can provide.

So I think that's what it is, and that richness, [00:30:00] like whatever you give, you get back much more than you give. So I think that's what keeps me here. And then the other people, right? Meeting colleagues like you, I think like-minded people in the profession.

Kenn: But when you talk to other physicians, I guess off duty, do they show an interest in doing what you're doing or they're scared off by the complexity and the challenges of your chosen field?

Duncan: I think it depends on the person. I think it's like you, if you're the kind of person that likes to see someone who's different than you and then see that as a challenge, as an interesting thing, which you have, right? So then you would, be at home in our clinic or if you're okay with things and not making quite sense or being very frustrating.

So I think our clinic, it's interesting that I think most people are actually either immigrants themselves or the children of immigrants, I think with a few exceptions.

 I think they're also the kind of people that are not intimidated by uncertainty or disorganization that everything doesn't quite make sense. but I think [00:31:00] you have to have some insight and I am thinking about your story and I was like, where did you get that insight from? You got it from that Quaker school, which seemed like quite important to have.

Then you did this political geography, which got you exposed to those concepts, and then you did it in real life by going to all those different places while getting exposed to a diversity of people in your hospital. I think anyone that's working with these international groups probably had like three different things come together like that where you have a deep appreciation for other cultures, even when it makes life more difficult.

Kenn: Yes. Interesting. I certainly agree. it seems strange to me that that's not my childhood. So my childhood was just Northern European from New Jersey. Nothing special in there. But as an adult and what I've chosen to do with the diversity in the travel and other cultures, but it's, not from my family, not from my background.

Like most everyone who works in your clinic, they have front desk people. They're often from other countries and have more appreciation. So for [00:32:00] me, it's not from childhood.

Duncan: But we do have some staff that are from American families that did go to, I think, Nepal, for example, or did things abroad. I need to learn more about the Quaker schooling, but I do think that probably had a very big effect on like your moral view of things.

Kenn: Yes, I agree. So, strong values of honesty, trust, respecting people, respecting differences, anti-war. So Quakers are famous, being anti-war and conscientious objectors, and not supporting the military industrial complex. But being a good person, that's a trite phrase. What is a good person? That's hard to answer.

But, putting, an importance on being a good person in the average school, I don't think that's valued being a good human being, a good citizen of the world. Uh, that's not my impression. Well, I got when I was young, but it was at the Quaker school being a good person, a good citizen of the world.

Duncan: And I think that respect for other cultures, it probably flows from having that, idea of being a good person [00:33:00] or that moral person. Right? I think you can't help but be interested and accepting of other groups if you take that message to heart.

Kenn: And I did. so the Quaker school, when I went with one third Quaker families, one third something else like me and one third Jewish But I became a Quaker when I was in high school and I was the only one. So I converted. It wasn't my family background. And that wasn't the goal of Quakerism isn't convert people. But I did by choice and it's to my benefit the rest of my life. so I was the exception.

Duncan: I'd like to learn more I know them from history in terms of being abolitionists during that period

Kenn: south Philadelphia, Sam William Penn is down in Pennsylvania. Philadelphia was the Quaker. And I'm gonna say there's two branches of Quakerism. Like there are almost everything. The conservative side was Herbert Hoover and Richard Nixon were Quakers but on the conservative side. I come from liberal side and there's a few Harborview physicians that come from the liberal side of Quakerism.

It came from [00:34:00] England 1620. George Fox was the founder. They left England at the time. America was starting, that's why they started Philadelphia and Pennsylvania. Right. To escape a religious persecution in Europe.

Duncan: I didn't know.

Kenn: And there's, it's called a Quaker meeting. So there's one near the University of Washington campus and there's smaller Quaker meetings in South Seattle, Bainbridge Island and various towns. And there's several Quaker colleges on the East coast.

Duncan: Do you go to these meetings at all?

Kenn: Uh, not often anymore. I used to, that's my background. One thing to say, there's no priest or minister or someone in charge. Everyone is in charge, and it's based on silence, not based on someone lecturing or telling you what to do. So there's a lot of silence. Everyone is equal and it's based on your personal, connection to a higher being.

It's up to individual. There's not a strong doctrine like many religions have very strong, strict doctrine. This is kind of [00:35:00] anti doctrine and it's up to the individual, and based on silence, not on preaching.

Duncan: One thing I didn't talk to you about with your involvement in FIUTS. I can't remember what FIUTS stands for.

Kenn: It's foundation for understanding with international students. It's been 75 years at uw. It's helping students from other countries adapt and adjust to American life. So I was at a FIUTS dinner last night. There were 30 students from various African countries, high school age students that were here for a month learning about American civics, how America works about helping the homeless, all kinds of things. So FIUTS has these programs for UW students from Hong Kong, from Sweden, from Brazil, to make friends and connect, if not to feel alone, to counter loneliness, which you often feel when you go to a new country. So it's a program to welcome students and some students are very active for years and they have a big concert every year.

It was three weeks ago, a [00:36:00] yearly concert where hundreds of people go, and my favorite, they have booze from the various countries, from Turkey, from Sweden, from Vietnam explaining so there were several Angolan students explaining they had their flag, their culture, or from Turkey from Nigeria.

So I love they get to be proud about their Turkish culture and educate people that don't know. The one that was most impressive to me recently, there's a UW group for indigenous people from Mexico and Central America, just indigenous people. I'm really impressed with that, that, not the mainstream culture in Mexico or in Guatemala

things like that. Or the Kurds near Syria and Iraq and Iran that never had their own country. So there's a, Kurdish community and getting to promulgate their culture, educate people.

Duncan: I know that some of the doctors in our clinic participate in some FIUTS lectures, but I, didn't [00:37:00] realize what a large program it is.

Kenn: They have many programs. They have several weekly programs. I go sometimes one is a conversation group. It's Wednesdays afternoons. Anyone can drop in. And it's for people that are not confident speaking English. Often people from Japan come and they wanna practice their English and make friends, always to make friends, to not feel like an outsider from the country they come from.

They're often from Japan, Brazil, and China for what it's worth. But any, any group can come making friends. Then they have a weekly potluck where any can come and bring cultural food from their country. Then for new students, they go to Mount Rainier, they go to Pike Place Market, they go to Halloween, things like that to understand American culture. they have a system where students from other countries get to join American family at Thanksgiving and understand that holiday, 

 So a lot of programs all meant to be integrated into this local community and not, [00:38:00] feel lonely. Yeah.

Duncan: Yeah.

Kenn: I brought the Harborview directory from 30 years ago,

Duncan: well, 1996 to 1997.

Kenn: Yes. And I know almost every name in the directory, so I know all kinds of people were any clinic. I know the people who started the refugee clinic long ago or started occupational medical clinic or doctors in the emergency room that were long gone.

So I'm a wealth of information about the history of Harborview and who was where. And obviously some clinics have moved, departments have changed, names have changed, like medical records is obviously the name change. Many staff people stay a long, long time from doctors or secretarial people, or front desk people.

A lot of people stay forever because it's a great place. You know, back to the mission statement, we like that. 

I'm down the hall from emergency room, but I don't always know what's going on. So I'll see something on the news and my friends tell me about an incident happened at Harborview down the hall and I, I didn't know it happened 'cause it's not the part, I say Harborview is a big complex place with six buildings and all kinds of things going on.

Duncan: [00:39:00] And of all the places that people don't get mail, it's probably the emergency department

Kenn: Not much. 

 Occasionally the borders do. another thing is flowers. Not as much the past couple years, but for years I got flowers sent by a loved one to a patient through Federal Express, and I deliver them. So they're always thrilled to get flowers. always when I walk in a room, deliver the flowers, they ask me who it's from. And I don't know. I'm delivering the box. I don't know who's sent it. And then other patients that are here for months order a lot of things, Amazon or boxes.

And then employees are shocked or don't understand it becomes their home. So some patients are here for months. This is their home. And they can pursue their hobby on knitting or reading or whatever they're into. Yes. That those things come in through me.

Duncan: I really like your idea about talking to the cleaners at Harborview.

Kenn: The front desk people

Duncan: desk. Yeah. Like

Kenn: Rahel in your clinic or anyone in ortho clinic, like all, all the clinics, the front desk person, they deal with literally the front [00:40:00] lines.

Duncan: and the medical side too. Yeah. So they have to deal with both sides and probably get harassed by both sides a little bit.

Kenn: Yes, that some doctors have a higher standard or want things a certain way, and some are more relaxed and they have to know that they have to deal with people's personalities. and then the information desk, or various place like me, people come, they've never been to Harborview, English, not the first language.

They don't know where they're going. They're lost all, all the time. I love that. That's maybe what I'm best at. After work on weekends and actually Christmas, the last several years, I, stay at the emergency room by where they come in and escort them. The room they've come from Moses Lake, their loved one is in room 620.

They have no idea how to get there. So I love being a mail escort , to people that are lost and confused.

Duncan: And you know where every room is? Yes.

Kenn: I, I can, I know every room.

Duncan: I think we covered a lot of things. I think we have some projects that we can work on.

Kenn: Yes. One thing I'll volunteer to help you find [00:41:00] people in terms of housekeeping or front desk staff, 'cause they know me and trust me. And some of them are gonna be intimidated because you're a doctor and they didn't go to college, and that education gap with some people matters. So I can

Duncan: Yeah. I, I would really appreciate that because I think inspired by like Studs Turkel, right? What he was trying to do was interview the people that typically don't get interviewed, right. And develop that picture. And then those groups of people are actually essential to the functioning of these institutions.

Absolutely.

Kenn: absolutely,

Duncan: Yeah. But it's easily overlooked or intentionally overlooked, I think, a lot historically

Kenn: I totally agree. Then we're saying Pat Fleet, Mike Copass, they were great people. They're people. so the housekeeper on the fourth floor is not a famous person. Doesn't wanna be, but they contribute a lot to Harborview.

Duncan: How can you juxtapose those, stories, maybe in some sort of brief compendium about the history of Harborview and just have [00:42:00] vignettes?

Kenn: It makes it fascinating, my opinion. That's fascinating,

Duncan: and just, yeah, different levels, different histories, and the fact that you were fascinated by Somali culture, and then you came here, and then the Somali diaspora came to you.

Kenn: right? I was first a tutor to a Somali family that didn't know the alphabet zero schooling, and I helped them then I went to 30 Somali weddings the next two years. Met a lot of people. And now, I'm part of the community and I've stayed particularly with one family. Lots and lots of people know me.

People come to actually to your clinic as a 25-year-old, and they remember me when they were five years old, they came to America and I was the first American they met. That's really gratifying to me now as an adult. I didn't recognize them, but they remember me. The only white guy that speaks their language.

That's fun for me.

Duncan: Thanks so much. I appreciate your time.

Kenn: Thank you. You signing off.

Duncan: Thank you for listening to this episode of the Provider Pulse series on the EthnoMed podcast. Kenn Arning reminds [00:43:00] us that the heartbeat of Harborview isn't just in the clinics or operating rooms. It's in the countless unseen connections that keep the hospital running from the mail room to the front desk to the bedside.

For pre-health students and medical providers, Ken's story is a reminder that providing patient care is a multidisciplinary effort and staff connections can help foster better patient care.

If you enjoyed this conversation, please share it with a colleague or friend and subscribe so you don't miss future episodes where we explore the hidden stories that shape our medical community.

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We would love to hear from you at EthnoMeduw@uw.edu. Thank you and see you at our next episode.